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Re: Rise and Fall in the International Waltz
Posted by anymouse
7/20/2008  5:40:00 AM
"As the moving foot of the person going backwards arrives under the body the heel of the suporting foot lowers to the floor. "

This is simply not the case for the Karen Hilton examples I examined, because her heel is on the floor while her feet are still apart. Yet you persist in ignoring this, even after asking me if her heel was on the floor and being told several times that it was.

It's also not the case for many others.

However, there are times when some leading dancers keep their heel up longer - Alessia for example, and you seem to have seen Lorraine doing it.
So clearly both are valid choices.

"This is exactly what the technique book say for any backward step."

It is what was written about a backwards step WITH NO RISE OR FALL. That is obviously not the situation in a feather step, where we have a backwards step incorporating substantial fall.

For many leading dancers, the addition of fall modifies the timing of the heel lowering, for others it apparently does not.

"Your failure to come up with any quote from any book."

The specific subject is not addressed by the book - something that I realize, but you keep ignoring.

You've found nothing in the technique book that literally addresses the lady's foot timing in a FEATHER STEP, only things that discuss the very different case WITHOUT RISE OR FALL.

Further, even if you had found something in the book, it would not necessarily be applicable to modern dancing. We've all seen how the men are lowering out their foot rise earlier than it says in the book, because they are going to be descending much deeper than contemplated in the book's era and need to get that foot flat on the floor before they start seriously bending their knee.
Re: Rise and Fall in the International Waltz
Posted by astaire
7/20/2008  7:16:00 AM
Alex Moore Page 13 paragraph 3.
Continue to move backwards, draw the RF back to the LF and at the same time lower slowly the left heel to the floor making sure it does not touch the floor untill the RF is level with it. This is similer to what my old teacher a world finalist would call I think, "a splitting of the feet" a must for all good dancers, here are some examples of what she ment. On the third step of the NT waltz, start moving the left toe back before the heal of the RF touches the floor. curving three step, start moving R toe before L heal touches floor. same action for coming out of chair into slip pivot, coming out of slip pivot into a DRS etc. This gives a greater softness and flow to the movement, you could say that one foot is always moving. This needs strong ankles and is one reason that we have exercises to strengthen them.Cheers
Re: Rise and Fall in the International Waltz
Posted by anymouse
7/20/2008  10:30:00 AM
"Continue to move backwards, draw the RF back to the LF and at the same time lower slowly the left heel to the floor making sure it does not touch the floor untill the RF is level with it. This is similer to what my old teacher a world finalist would call I think, "a splitting of the feet" a must for all good dancers,"

It's a good idea in many situations, but by no means all situations. The description quoted applies literally only to the described situation of a walking step taking with no rise or fall, though it can also be the appropriate technique for some (but not all) steps that do feature rise or fall - depending in large part on the path of rise or fall chosen by that dancer in that particular movement.

Which is why it's easy to find video examples of world champs doing otherwise, and lowering their heel long before the feet close. In fact you yourself (assuming you are the same "astaire") mentioned this the other day.
Re: Rise and Fall in the International Waltz
Posted by Polished
7/22/2008  3:04:00 AM
Anonymous. It does say for the man going forward and I will quote . Page 10. At the full extent of the stride the heel of the front foot and the toe of the back foot will be touching the floor. Lower the right toe imediately so that the foot is flat on the floor. For the lady the heel of the supporting foot will not lower untill the moving foot is level with it. Page 13. For the lady there is no foot rise NFR. Only body rise.
Re: Rise and Fall in the International Waltz
Posted by phil.samways
7/22/2008  5:22:00 AM
Can somebody explain how to play youtube video clips in slow motion?
Re: Rise and Fall in the International Waltz
Posted by anymouse
7/22/2008  6:03:00 AM
"Can somebody explain how to play youtube video clips in slow motion?"

You need a tool that will download them, and a program that can play .flv files slowly.
Re: Rise and Fall in the International Waltz
Posted by astaire
7/22/2008  9:00:00 AM
The tool I use is YouTube Downloader. It also converts it for you.
Re: Rise and Fall in the International Waltz
Posted by anymouse
7/22/2008  6:03:00 AM
"Anonymous. It does say for the man going forward and I will quote . Page 10. At the full extent of the stride..."

Once again you try to pass off the description of a walk action with NO RISE AND NO FALL as being literally valid for a step danced with rise and fall.

It just ain't so. You will never understand dancing as long as you sloppily ignore such key differences.

When the subject is a feather step, if you want a literal description you must find something written specifically ABOUT THE FEATHER STEP, or at at the very least something with a comparable action in the vertical dimension.
Re: Rise and Fall in the International Waltz
Posted by Polished
7/22/2008  5:44:00 PM
Phil. Anybody knows more about computers than I do. What I do is press pause. Then I go to that thermometor looking thing and move the figures a fraction at a time . Sometimes I dont know how without me doing anything it goes into slow motion and stays that way untill I exit completely.
Another thing I do is if I want those pictures without going on the internet. I video them off the screen with my ordinary digital camera. I load them onto the computer just like a photo and it goes into my picture file. I have also found a way of getting the images onto that little plug in gadget. i think it is called an SUB. I can then take them to another computer. At this present time I haven't been able to copy from youtube to a DVD. I hope this helps. Cheers
Re: Rise and Fall in the International Waltz
Posted by phil.samways
7/24/2008  4:03:00 AM
Hi Polished
I've tried using the pause button, but it doesn't work very well. I think there is a fundamental technical reason for this. Clicking the pause button on/off very fast isn't too bad. I've never had it 'fall' into slow motion. I presume by 'SUB' you mean USB.

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